Jennifer Knapp: Lesbian-Christian Singer-Songwriter | This Way Out Radio Episode #1953
- This Way Out
- 20 minutes ago
- 7 min read
On her journey from Kansas to Oz and back, Jennifer Knapp’s spiritual rock and roll harmonizes “Christian” and “lesbian" with the unifying power of music (interviewed by David Hunt).
And in NewsWrap: a court in Kenya orders lawmakers to protect the rights of transgender people for the first time on the African continent, Dr. Demetre Daskalakis is cheered as a hero for resigning from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention along with other CDC leaders protesting HHS Secretary Robert F. Kennedy, Jr’s policies, outspoken Illinois Governor J.B. Pritzker goes on offense announcing a statewide LGBTQ legal hotline, a U.S, federal judge closes the door on a lawsuit by disgruntled members of Kappa Kappa Gamma sorority’s trans-inclusive stand, former AFL West Coast Eagles defender Mitch Brown comes out bisexual, and more international LGBTQ+ news reported this week by Michael Taylor Gray and Ava Davis (produced by Brian DeShazor).
All this on the September 1, 2025 edition of This Way Out!
Join our family of listener-donors today at thiswayout.org/donate/
Complete Program Summary
for the week of September 1, 2025
Jennifer Knapp: Lesbian-Christian Singer-Songwriter
NewsWrap (full transcript below): A Kenyan court becomes the first on the African continent to order lawmakers to protect the rights of transgender people … out U.S. Centers for Disease Control official Dr. Demetre Daskalakis joins other high-profile medical directors to resign, dissing Health Secretary Robert F. Kennedy, Jr.’s and President Donald Trump’s anti-science politics [with brief comments by the good doctor] … firebrand Illinois Democratic Governor J.B. Pritzker announces a first-in-the-nation state-sponsored hotline offering advice on legal and related issues to LGBTQ people and their families and friends [with brief excerpts from his remarks] … an exasperated U.S. federal judge again rejects efforts by a few disgruntled members of the University of Wyoming chapter of the Kappa Kappa Gamma sorority to expel transgender sister Artemis Langford, and further denies them the chance to try again … Perth’s former West Coast Eagles defender MITCH BROWN becomes the first out bisexual pro in the 129-year history of the Australian Football League [with brief excerpts from his exclusive interview with The Daily Aus] (written by GREG GORDON and LUCIA CHAPPELLE, produced by BRIAN DeSHAZOR, and reported this week by MICHAEL TAYLOR GRAY and AVA DAVIS).
Feature: In the “genre-fied” music industry, it’s rare for an artist to remind us that “Christian” and “lesbian” can harmonize quite nicely, thank you. One singer-songwriter has been striking that chord for longer than you might imagine on a journey from Kansas to Oz and back again. Jennifer Knapp talks with This Way Out’s DAVID HUNT about the unifying power of music and working for queer equality in faith communities (featuring excerpts from Into You, Undo Me, Remedy, Dive In, Lay It Down (Live), Hold Me Now, Kansas 25 Whole Again and Forget the Past, all by JENNIFER KNAPP).
NewsWrap
A summary of some of the news in or affecting
LGBTQ communities around the world
for the week ending August 30th, 2025
Written by Greg Gordon and Lucia Chappelle,
reported this week by MICHAEL TAYLOR GRAY and AVA DAVIS,
produced by BRIAN DeSHAZOR
A court in Kenya has ordered lawmakers to protect the rights of transgender people. The victorious ruling for trans woman Shieys Chepkosgei is being called a “first” on the African continent.
Chepkosgei is identified in court documents only as “S.C.” She’s been living in her affirmed gender since childhood and competed in women’s athletics as a marathon runner while living abroad. However, while visiting Moi Teaching and Referral Hospital in the city of Eldoret in 2019, she was arrested and charged with “impersonation.” She was taken to a women’s prison and strip searched. A court ordered a “gender determination” process that included a genital examination, hormone testing, blood sampling and radiological testing. Her medical records were later leaked to local media.
The rights group Transgender Education and Advocacy backed Chepkosgei’s lawsuit against the Kenya Prisons Service and the Eldoret hospital. She charged that the treatment she faced was unconstitutional and that her rights to privacy and dignity had been violated.
Eldoret High Court Justice Reuben N Nyakundi agreed with “S.C.” He wrote that her freedom from inhuman and degrading treatment had also been violated and awarded her 1,000,000 Kenyan Shillings – about 7,700 U.S. dollars -- in damages. Nyakundi also ordered the government to address the rights of trans Kenyans. The legislature can either amend the pending Intersex Persons Bill or introduce transgender protections separately.
Speaking for the queer rights group Jinsiangu, Lolyne Onger told Mamba Online he’s looking for “clear legal recognition of gender identity, [protect] against discrimination in employment, housing, healthcare and education, [and provide] access to public services, without bias or harassment.”
Hostility towards LGBTQ people runs high in Kenya. The East African nation offers no legal protections, same-gender sex is criminalized, sexual and gender minorities are shunned by society, and verbal and physical abuse is routine. Trans people cannot legally change gender.
The National Gay and Lesbian Human Rights Commission won its right to official legal recognition as a non-governmental organization in the Kenyan Supreme Court in 2023 after years of litigation.
It’s not clear whether Justice Nyakundi’s ruling can be appealed, or how lawmakers will respond to his order.
[SOUND: Daskalakis]
(crowd cheers) … You are the people who protect America … and we will be your loudest advocates … (crowd cheers)
Dr. Demetre Daskalakis was cheered as a hero when he departed the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention along with other CDC leaders who resigned on August 27th. The bold, gay Immunization and Respiratory Diseases official most recently led the U.S. response to Mpox. Now he’s another causality of President Donald Trump’s war on science and truth.
Daskalakis and his compatriots walked out on the heels of the administration’s attempt to fire CDC Director Susan Monarez. She’s resisting. Her lawyers point to her refusal to rubber-stamp what they called “unscientific, reckless directives” from Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. The Secretary with no professional experience in medicine or healthcare has denied the effectiveness of vaccines.
In his blistering resignation letter, Dr. Daskalakis said in part, “After much contemplation and reflection on recent developments and perspectives brought to light by Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr., I find that the views he and his staff have shared challenge my ability to continue in my current role at the agency and in the service of the health of the American people.”
He called out the agency for “radical non-transparency,” “unskilled manipulation of data,” and charged his bosses with being “people of dubious intent and more dubious scientific rigor.”
As deputy health commissioner in New York City at the height of the COVID-19 pandemic, the 51-year-old doctor championed specific outreach to the LGBTQ+ community. He then became the Biden administration’s Director of the CDC’s Division of HIV and AIDS Prevention. His confrontational style drives the far-right crazy with his prolific pentagram tattoos, leather gear and suggestive “thirst trap” social media posts.
His resignation letter went on to cite “the recklessness of the administration in their efforts to erase transgender populations, cease critical domestic and international HIV programming, and terminate key research to support equity as part of my decision.”
Dr. Daskalakis told The Advocate, “I gave up my job as a red flag. … This is a five-alarm fire. If people don’t act now, ideology will fully consume science.”
Illinois’ outspoken Democratic Governor J.B. Pritzker says he likes “going on offense, and not [being] on defense.”
[SOUND: Pritzker]
The state of Illinois, today, I am announcing, is launching a first-of-its-kind legal hotline for LGBTQ individuals across the state … [inaudible] (cheers)
The debut of Illinois Pride Connect came soon after the Trump administration pulled funding for a federal queer youth suicide prevention hotline.
[SOUND: Pritzker]
(cheers fade up) [inaudible] … Illinois Pride Connect will provide resources for healthcare education, immigration, social services family protections and beyond. It will answer frequently asked questions. It’ll inform individuals of their rights and provide advocacy tools. Together we are fighting ignorance with information, we are fighting cruelty with compassion.
The state jump-started funding of the helpline with a $250,000 investment and $100,000 in private donations. Additional funding has come from non-profit organizations like the Illinois Department of Health and Human Services, the Legal Council for Health Justice, and the queer advocacy group Equality Illinois.
Illinois Pride Connect operates in both English and Spanish from 9am to 4pm local time Mondays through Thursdays. Find them online at ILPrideConnect.org.
A U.S. federal judge is fed up with Artemis Langford’s Kappa Kappa Gamma sorority sisters trying to boot her out of their University of Wyoming chapter. Disgruntled alumni members who objected to the acceptance of a trans woman got their first taste of District Judge Alan B. Johnson justice in 2023. He wrote in his original ruling, “Nothing in the bylaws or the standing rules requires Kappa to narrowly define the words ‘women’ or ‘woman’ to include only individuals born with a certain set of reproductive organs.”
Kappa Kappa Gamma’s definition of women was revised to include trans women in 2015 by the national Kappa Fraternity Council. Langford became its first transgender sister seven years later.
About a year after losing on appeal, the plaintiffs refiled their lawsuit challenging Langford’s membership. An exasperated Johnson re-stated that he did not intend to interfere in the sorority’s “valid interpretation of its own bylaws.” He dismissed the case on August 22nd “with prejudice” – which means that the complaint cannot be brought before any judge again.
Finally …
[SOUND: Brown]
“I played in the AFL for 10 years …and I’m a bisexual man.”
… former Perth-based West Coast Eagles defender Mitch Brown shook up the sport this week by coming out as bi in The Daily Aus. He says the pressure of hiding his sexuality contributed to his decision to retire in 2016 at the age of 28. No former or current male player has ever publicly identified as gay or bi in the League’s 129-year history.
Toxic masculinity continues to prevail. A “highly offensive” homophobic slur against an opponent got high-profile player Izak Rankine suspended for several matches in June, essentially ending his season. Brown declined to condemn the insult:
[SOUND: Brown]
On the field, you're trying to beat your opponent … right … trying to win, and the best way to do that is to show your strength. One of the ways you do that is to belittle your opponent.
His former Eagles teammates were enthusiastic in their support, writing in a social media post, “We love you, Mitch … We’re proud of you and how you’re living your values to make footy and our society a better place.”
Brown stepped into his new role with grace:
[SOUND: Brown]
It’s such a privilege, the fact that I can sit here and say I'm comfortable and strong in talking about my sexuality.